5 Year Old Who Drew A Gun In Crayon Forced To Sign No-Suicide Contract With School
from the a-thousand-words dept
When I was in middle-school, Mortal Kombat was released on home video game consoles. Because my friends and I loved the game so much, we used to draw pictures of the characters doing seriously horrible things to one another. As in, rectal-based spine-retrieval type of stuff. It was fun and it was funny…and if we did that today, I have to assume we all would have ended up arrested and in some kind of psychiatric facility.
It’s the only conclusion I can draw as America begins to build a tradition of penalizing, and in some cases further traumatizing, children for playing make believe in any way that includes a gun or a bomb. But to really get into a situation where stupid adults take some innocuous creativity by a child and use it as a springboard to absolutely mess with that child’s state of mind, we must go to Alabama.
A Mobile, Ala., mom says school officials forced her daughter to sign a contract promising not to commit suicide or harm others after the kindergartner “drew something that resembled a gun,” then pointed a crayon at another kid and said “pew, pew!” 5-year-old Elizabeth was sent home after school officials made her take a questionnaire to evaluating [sic] her for suicidal thoughts, then had her sign the safety contract promising to contact an adult if she was thinking of suicide or homicide. This all happened while her mom waited in the lobby to pick her up, the upset parent told WPMI.
Okay, everyone stop what you’re doing right now and seriously think about this for a moment. A public elementary school in the United States, an agent for the public good, coerced a five year old into signing a contract promising not to goddamn off herself because she “pew-pewed” with a crayon. You know, that same thing most of us did as children? The thing where you take some object and point it like a gun and make a cartoon noise? Yeah, a five year old was confronted with the concept of suicide by the school over that.
According to her mom, Elizabeth didn’t know most of the words on the contract she signed. “Suicide,” in particular, was a new one for her.
“Mommy, daddy, what is suicide?” Elizabeth’s mother says she asked.
Holy hell, to foist that upon a child so young is insane.
Comments on “5 Year Old Who Drew A Gun In Crayon Forced To Sign No-Suicide Contract With School”
I wonder:
– how do they propose to enforce the contract?
– what penalties would they apply if she breached the contract?
Re: Contract
You don’t have kids in school, do you?
“Contract” is one of those educationese words that don’t mean the same thing as in the real world. (Another favorite of mine is “rubric”.)
In educationese, “contract” means “pledge”, sort of. It’something you’re pressured to agree to in exchange for nothing, with no stated penalties for breach (but horrible implied ones having to do with your immortal soul).
Re: Re: Contract
Yep, this.
I remember being a kid (not as young as this one) and being presented with a couple of these “contracts”. They’re a bit of a joke, and the kids know they’re a bit of a joke. They’re just some nonsense that you have to sign to get the grownups to stop bothering you.
Re: Re: Re: Contract
They’re just some nonsense that you have to sign to get the grownups to stop bothering you.
Some of us adults seem to have forgotten what is to be a child. Essentially they achieved nothing with this kiid and probably a lawsuit from her parents.
Re: Re: Re:2 Contract
I disagree… they DID achieve something: They started teaching this child early on that contracts aren’t worth the paper they’re written on, and that people use them to try and force you to do things they don’t like — even when what you actually did is only tenuously related to what they don’t like.
We’ve had an entire generation of this now, and it shows. This is why people are so surprised now when they discover that adult contracts actually have legal consequences — that’s not taught too much in schools.
Re: Re: Re: Contract
That hasn’t changed much. Adults get those too; we call them EULAs.
Re: Re:
And the no homicide contract is just as silly. If the reasons not to kill someone before signing the contract aren’t enough to stop them then what’s an additional contract going to do? That’s like adding more laws banning the use of knives or guns for murder when murder is already illegal. The way to convince a criminal not to break one of these laws is to simply add more laws that they would be breaking if they commit these acts. Because when you are a politician the solution to everything is more laws.
I got an idea. Lets make everyone sign a contract not to break the law.that will convince everyone to abide by it and no one will ever break anymore laws.
Re: Re: Re:
Great now your giving future politicians an idea … hope you have the copyright on it.
Re: Re: Nothing on earth dumber than a school administrator
Just a single braincell running their mouth.
Re: Re:
Clearly, if she should breach the contract, the school intends to reanimate her as a zombie.
Re: Re:
Is it legal to force a minor to sign a contract? Did they also try to get a signature from a legal guardian? I would have loved to hear that conversation.
Re: Re: Re:
It’s not actually a legal contract at all (minors can’t enter into legal contracts). It’s more like mind games.
Re: Re: Re: Re:
Re: Re:
Termination
Get a psychologist to check the mental state of the teachers, they seem to have severe paranoia.
Re: Re:
That. Alabama has to seriously consider if these morons are fit to the job.
Imagine if little George Lucas lived today? Star Wars would be killed in the first pew-pews…
Wow. Stop the world..i want to get off..
Re: Re:
If you’re serious about that, Oregon has a death with dignity law and plenty of craft stores with all the crayons you need to carry out the deed.
Re: Re: Re:
Well, it’s a start. Unfortunately, in this case a “life with dignity” law would seem more important.
Re: Re: Re: Re:
“life with dignity”
Well, Oregon DEFINITELY doesn’t have that. They don’t even trust you enough to pump your own gas.
Re: Re: Re:2 Re:
“They don’t even trust you enough to pump your own gas.”
That’s an unfair characterization. It’s not about lack of trust at all. The reason that Oregon doesn’t allow you to pump your own gas is because that’s the way Oregon residents want it. The gas stations badly want the law to be overturned, but every time it gets put up for a vote (this happens frequently), the people want to keep things the way they are. There are a number of reasons for that, none of which have anything to do with trust.
Re: Re: Re:2 Re:
Oregon has its issues, but not pumping your own gas isn’t one of them. The locals see it as a way to create jobs for young and/or poor people. Sure, we pay more for gas, but the benefits to society of having less unemployment seem to be worth it.
Re: Re: Re:3 Re:
This sort of job creation is not a benefit to society.
Re: Re: Re:4 Re:
It’s also not the main reason the law has so much popular support.
Re: Re: Re:4 Re:
I agree that there are much better methods of job creation, but compared to the lack of real alternatives, it’s decent.
Re: Re: Re:3 Re:
Re: Re: Re:4 Re:
That would be legitimate criticism, however, since Oregon hasn’t slipped down that slope, it’s irrelevant.
And you don’t pay or tip the gas attendants extra. The cost is built into the purchase. They don’t accept tips.
Re: Re: Re:
You have to already be near death in order to use the death with dignity law.
Re: Re: Re: Re:
If they put a cop in her school, then I think the death with dignity law might apply depending on how trigger-happy he is.
So my question is did they have a form letter for this?
Like they just have a stack of these forms in a drawer somewhere in case this happens?
Who wants to bet this was some district school wide mandate for any student, with the obvious aim being towards middle school and high school students. And because school teachers and administrators want zero tolerance because that means they can always fall back on “not my fault I was only following the rules” this form was handed to a 5 year old.
Seriously bizarrely stupid on all levels.
I honestly pity kids nowadays. Because there are self-entitled adults that are actually little tyrants and haven’t grown at all that are ruining today kids childhoods.
So, how do we enforce a no suicide contract when they commit suicide anyway? Shoot their corpse with bullets to ‘execute’ them for committing suicide?
Re: Re:
You can’t, silly.
But you can punish attempted suicide. With the death penalty.
Re: Re: Re:
Seems like a win-win situation.
Re: Re: Re: Re:
Have you seen/read about the executions by injection? My god that’s torture worse than the CIA.
Sure, you may end up dead anyway, but every serious attempt at suicide I’ve ever heard about is quicker and less painful than execution by lethal injection.
Re: Re: Re:2 Re:
My wife is a nurse, and she says that, based on her experience in the emergency room, a lot of serious suicide attempts result in a nightmare with fun things like paralysis, brain damage, and horrible, chronic, incurable illnesses.
As she puts it, it’s harder than you think to actually kill somebody (even yourself). Even (or especially) if your method of choice is a gun. If you don’t know what you’re doing, there’s a significant chance that you’ll survive it — and any serious attempt means that you’ve done yourself very serious damage.
Re: Re: Re:3 Re:
I keep reading that prisons can’t buy some of the ingredients of the standard “lethal cocktail” because the European makers oppose the death penalty.
I wonder what is wrong with a plain old massive overdose of morphine? That’s not hard to get. What does your wife say?
Re: Re:
The contract allows them to sue the child’s estate for damages
Uhhhhhh. Because someone who wants to commit suicide, who is prepared to leave everything they have in their life, who has made up their mind — or isn’t concerned — over making their loved ones sad, who is prepared to inflict such harm upon themselves to end their life, will give the slightest damn about a contract.
The mentality of the people having that child sign this kind of nonsense is most repulsive. It sure feels like they only did this to avoid that parade of horribles called liability. It’s akin to corporations whose services’ terms of service are designed to say “we’ll screw you over, take a hands-off approach when called out, and keep our hands clean.”
It’s very telling. This is the culture and mentality foisted upon the common folk.
"... including but not limited to ... "
It’s a relief that the school’s contract did not specify, in explicit detail, all the known operational methods that this prohibited act of suicide might consist of.
A minor can't agree to a contract
Actual real live grownups would know that, but then again: Alabama.
Re: A minor can't agree to a contract
Really?
This stupid crap is happening everywhere! Not just alabama… this is all the result of leftist ideologies.
Re: Re: A minor can't agree to a contract
Alabama is leftist? Yeah. Surrrrre it is.
Re: Re: Re: A minor can't agree to a contract
School is majority leftist no matter where you go.
Sure you can find crazy righties running around too… but keep in mind. school back int he day was more to the right now its more to the left without any doubt. Just because the state is largely right politically does not have any bearing here.
Re: Re: Re:2 A minor can't agree to a contract
Where I am from, that would be in t’day (pronounced int day) not int he day!
Re: Re: Re:2 A minor can't agree to a contract
Re: Re: Re: A minor can't agree to a contract
Because everyone knows that teacher’s unions are right-wing institutions.
Re: Re: A minor can't agree to a contract
There is no political monopoly on stupid.
But if you’re going to bring up politics, I thought alabama was almost entirely republican.
Re: Re: Re: A minor can't agree to a contract
I agree… just because I focused on a terrible leftist reaction to things does not mean I am giving the stupid stuff the right does either.
I think everyone knows that a states primary political leaning has very little impact on how left or right their local schools are. Sure there are crazy rightist crap too, but you have far more stupid from the left on these things.
Re: Re: Re:2 A minor can't agree to a contract
You’re generalizing just to bash the left. Having gone to school in Alabama, I’ve experienced how rightist they can be by and large. But this kind of stupidity isn’t partisan, it’s paranoid, so the distinction is irrelevant. “For the children” blurs all political lines.
If you had said colleges are generally more to the left, you might have not sounded like you were just trying to bash the lefties.
Re: Re: Re:3 A minor can't agree to a contract
Generalizations work because they often are true, sure sometimes they are wrong and come from misinformed people. I cannot claim that I am so perfect that I will not get some wrong as well… but I have found those most against generalizations are those most guilty of them.
Humanity is a hugely hypocritical species. Both the left and the right talk smack against generalizations until it serves their purposes. But there are things the are more often attributed to either side. For example…
The right talks up religious freedom, but also supported blue laws. The left preaches tolerance but are intolerant of any other ideologies not of them.
The left constantly upholds their side as the intellectual superior despite the majority of their votes coming from an electorate they constantly harp on for being under educated.
The right will bitch about voter fraud while not being concerned over the innocent people on death row or being incarcerated.
Both are corporate whores, and the majority of Americans are cowards that are busy forgiving only in favor of their party in power rather than expunging the corrupt people out of fear that the other side might win if they do it.
George Washington’s farewell address, go and read it, you can learn how I feel about the party, left vs right, and geo political BS that abounds. This is why I feel it is important to talk about the crap that either side gives us… talking about each sides problems helps to break down barriers not build them up. Not talking about them and acting like they are not there is exactly what keeps them going.
Like all the rest of you here that want to admonish me, really just like to run your mouths and ultimately do nothing to solve any problems and try to avoid any real conversation to resolve problems.
Re: Re: Re:4 A minor can't agree to a contract
Generalizations often don’t work because they aren’t always true. If you have to resort to a generalization, then you’re ultimately just taking a chance that someone with a bit more research or experience than you will contradict you with anecdotes or possibly even evidence.
But none of this matters because the discussions about this article aren’t an effective place for effecting the change you seem to want to pursue. You’re complaining that people are just using a discussion forum for discussing things. That’s like complaining that people are eating in a restaurant.
I recommend taking some sociology courses at a university or join an activist group if you’re looking for like-minded people with whom you can pursue that change.
In the social change and stratification courses I took in college, I learned that significant social and political change is usually effected by organized groups of people who apply specific kinds of pressure upon those in power (not necessarily politicians) to make the situation such that they find it to be in their own best interest to allow the change to occur, while the activists also do not disrupt the daily lives of the people who are already either on their side or presently apathetic too much because too much disruption of possible allies leads them to put effort into opposing you. It also takes a lot of failed efforts and patience typically.
You also don’t know what anyone here might do IRL that involves fighting for change, so you can’t just outright dismiss anyone who isn’t saying the same thing as you as liking to run their mouths.
Re: Re: Re:4 A minor can't agree to a contract
I’m actually of the opinion that attributing general human failings to a political affiliation worsens the partisan divide. “Politics” is very damaging. Call out individuals on their failings, rather than fueling non-productive bickering. There should be no sides to matters of governance, and reinforcing that mentality just makes it more difficult for rational debate to be had.
So, yes, please pretend that there are no sides in our country.
Re: Re: Re:2 A minor can't agree to a contract
“I think everyone knows that a states primary political leaning has very little impact on how left or right their local schools are”
However, the political leanings of the area covered by the school district have a great deal to do with it. Where I live, school districts in more liberal areas tend to lean left, and school districts in the more conservative areas tend to lean right.
Re: Re: Re:3 A minor can't agree to a contract
I do not disagree with what you say, but what you say also supports what I put forward.
I said the state over all has very little political influence because of what you just said… the local area tends to have a larger impact. But it is also not a mistake to realize that Central Gov & Teacher Unions have a large impact globally and even when a local school is largely right there are still plenty of left influences to counter this a lot whereas a left lean generally will not have the counter of a right lean.
Both sides can learn from the other by pointing out the problems, instead of getting all butt hurt and screaming when a problem is pointed out, which I know is a very default reaction, but just like anything else, something we need to over come!
Re: Re: Re:4 A minor can't agree to a contract
“Both sides can learn from the other by pointing out the problems”
To be honest, I’m not convinced that this is actually a problem, or at least, that it’s a large enough problem to make a big stink about it. It’s a natural outgrowth of the rationale behind having local school districts in the first place: so that the schools operate in a way that is consistent with the local community’s sensibilities.
Re: Re: Re: A minor can't agree to a contract
Alabama tends to be R outside the cities, but that’s the trend in most of the country. The education system nationwide tends to be overwhelmingly liberal, even in conservative dominated areas. Depending on who is in charge of the district and specific school it can be outright and actively hostile to non-liberals, which is worse in the cities and colleges based on my experience.
Re: Re: A minor can't agree to a contract
” this is all the result of leftist ideologies.”
Facepalm!
Re: Re: Re: A minor can't agree to a contract
Wow…
Did you hit yourself in the face because it was a revelation for you?
I am certainly welcome for you to provide how this would not be leftist in nature. Last time I checked most people on the right do not flip out cause their kid drew a gun or bomb.. or even played cowboys and indians or emulated something they saw on TV.
Re: Re: Re:2 A minor can't agree to a contract
“I am certainly welcome for you to provide how this would not be leftist in nature.”
I’ve now read this sentence three times and I can’t figure out what kind of English this is supposed to be. As for leftist/right-wing, this story is apolitical. I can’t understand why anyone would think that the world needs to be divided into left/right on every last stupid thing….
“Last time I checked most people on the right do not flip out cause their kid drew a gun or bomb.”
You’re kidding me w/this, right? The right wing has multiple time lost their collective shit over anything to do w/Islam in schools, suggesting that it’s linked to terrorism and whatnot. Terrorism = violence, by guns or bombs. You’re wrong.
Re: Re: Re:3 A minor can't agree to a contract
If you cannot figure it out, it only means you are more indoctrinated that you might believe.
Regarding Muslims. I don’t remember anyone going to a Muslim child and forcing them to sign a contract to not blow up the school. Do you?
Considering human history in its entirety, there is more cause for concern with a religion being controlled by crazy priests than kids drawing guns.
This is humanity, be it Muslim, Christian, or Buddhism… any group being lead by crazy is not healthy. Unfortunately too many Muslims are being lead by crazy currently and hopefully that can change in the future. Stay tuned…
Re: Re: Re:4 A minor can't agree to a contract
If you cannot figure it out, it only means you are more indoctrinated that you might believe.
Take a look in the mirror. He may not be the most politically sane person I know (who the fuck is entirely sane at all?) but he’s spot on in this one.
Regarding Muslims. I don’t remember anyone going to a Muslim child and forcing them to sign a contract to not blow up the school. Do you?
Way to miss the point. He’s talking about the collective freak out against Muslims for no reason other than overreaction.
Considering human history in its entirety, there is more cause for concern with a religion being controlled by crazy priests than kids drawing guns.
Really. But the school is full of leftist commies right? Stop, you are making a fool of yourself.
This is humanity, be it Muslim, Christian, or Buddhism… any group being lead by crazy is not healthy.
Indeed. Except there’s no crazy leadership for Muslims, just some minority that goes to extremes (hellooo left/right wackos!!!)
Unfortunately too many Muslims are being lead by crazy currently
More Muslims disagree with some sort of religious profiling than Christians or Jewish. Search for it. I was pretty amused by that fact myself.
Again, you should review your things.
Re: Re: Re:4 A minor can't agree to a contract
If you cannot figure it out, it only means you are more indoctrinated that you might believe.
No. It just means you’re a shitty writer. Apparently you’re even worse at reading comprehension because the rest of the sentence reads “… what kind of English this is.”
And Dark Helmet is correct: this kind of shit is FAR more often spawned from ideologies on the right.
Re: Re: Re:3 A minor can't agree to a contract
Terrorism = Instilling fear through the vague threat of causing some sort of harm to innocent people at some unspecified future time.
FTFY
Re: Re: Re:2 A minor can't agree to a contract
“I am certainly welcome for you to provide how this would not be leftist in nature.”
Speaking as a confirmed leftist, this is not just wrong, but insanely wrong.
Alabama is, in case you haven’t been paying attention for the last century or so, religious, conservative, racist, misogynist, xenophobic and bigoted. Not everyone, of course, but as a state, it’s one of the most regressive and — not coincidentally — it is consistently ranked as having the worst or next-to-worst school system out of all 50 states. (Sometimes Mississippi edges it out for this “honor”.)
So if you’re going to insist on a crackpot theory that this stupidity is based in leftist political sentiment, then you’re completely out of your mind, because this happened in a state that is about as right-wing as they get. (Jebus, have you been there? There are people still fighting the Civil War and flying the Confederate flag and trying to get their slaves back and well, pretty much living in 1860. Yes, REALLY.)
It’s obvious to the rest of us that this is based in stupidity, which owes no political allegiance and exists in great quantities at all levels in the structures of government. The people who abused this child simply weren’t smart enough to consider what would be appropriate (I vote for “do nothing”) and what the consequences of their actions would be.
And that’s IT. Your attempts to recast this as an outgrowth of ideology are not only horribly misguided, they’re also becoming tiresome.
Re: Re: Re: A minor can't agree to a contract
Lemme join you.
facepalm
The world is doomed.
Re: Re: A minor can't agree to a contract
“this is all the result of…”
… a highly litigious society with a propensity toward violence, and the inevitable result of the inflexible zero tolerance policies that have been put in to deflect financial and legal liability away from the school board as a result.
Fixed that for people who aren’t partisan morons who think that politics is a team game.
Re: Re: Re: A minor can't agree to a contract
This is also true, but failing to label the source of this stupidity is like saying…
There is a major business stealing money from people every time they do business with them.
And when asked which business this is… the response is… a MAJOR business.
Sorry no win for you, you just might be the moron… I am not partisan either… I just call it like it is. Lawyers which swell the ranks of Congress and the left more frequently than the right are of this.
I think those of you whom call this partisan are the most partisan of all, just like those whom decry tolerance are the most intolerant! And your staunch defense of the left is actually making it more of a partisan problem thereby exacerbating it and conflating it beyond what I intend.
Stupidity such as this are part and parcel for all walks of life, and calling each walk out on that stupidity is important! I give no pass to the left or the right… in this case its a leftist problem, so own up! When its time to pick on the right I will do so then as well.
Additionally the inability to call a spade a spade is another problem on the left. If you are insulted by what I say, then you probably deserve to be.
Re: Re: Re:2 A minor can't agree to a contract
No one’s insulted – it’s just that Alabama is a RED state.
I’m calling a spade a spade.
It’s characteristic of the right to blame the left when their ass-backwards fuckery goes wrong.
This is yet another example.
Re: Re: Re:3 A minor can't agree to a contract
You are right, I see lefties and righties blame each other when they are at fault themselves…
And if you read what I said… this is DESPITE it being a red state. The central government, teachers unions, and the local area have far more impact than the state does not schools.
You are dead wrong to consider anything I said an example of this. If anything I am a centrist that would piss off both parties fairly equally with the things I say.
For example.. I think both Obama and Bush should have been impeached. Bush for the DHS/Patriot Act and response to 9/11 and Obama for taking all of the Bush policies even further and trying to dismantle America.
Re: Re: Re:4 A minor can't agree to a contract
But Bush is Right and Obama is Left, right? Even though they are the same shit, right?
Re: Re: Re:4 A minor can't agree to a contract
If anything I am a centrist that would piss off both parties fairly equally with the things I say.
Sure.
Just like Fox News is “Fair and Balanced.”
Re: Re: Re:2 A minor can't agree to a contract
Left and Right are long outdated. There are lots of nuances. Start calling them Communists as some sort of “bad trait” and you’ll make as much sense.
Re: Re: Re: A minor can't agree to a contract
Dude, you are a staunch defender of the left! I therefore declare you the enemy of Capitalism!
Re: Re: A minor can't agree to a contract
> … this is all the result of leftist ideologies.
This is not leftist. It is brainless, as in whoever came up with this couldn’t be bothered to think even five seconds ahead of themselves.
I guess now all the great cartoons I loved when I was growing up are now going to be held from viewing before 11:00 PM. Bugs Bunny, Marvin The Martian, Elmer Fudd, Foghorn Leghorn (Loud-mouthed Schnook), Roadrunner & Wile E. Coyote, all held to be encouraging sociopathic behaviour.
Home schooling is looking more necessary every day, and they’re probably trying to figure out how to illegalize that too.
gawd help these kids when they’re old enough to walk into a public library by themselves. Instant trauma central!
Re: Re: A minor can't agree to a contract
This sounds to me like the Redneck, Conservative, Religious nuts of the middle ages.
This is definately not of any person with the left leaning. Nor is it something that any compassionate,loving administrator would come up with. It is the hate filled garbage we hear coming from the Republican party. The political ads we see on TV are full of this type of garbage. None of them say what they would like to do for the good of our country, just how awful their opponents are.
Won’t someone think of the children?
It's even dumber than that
Other posters raise a good point about the absurdity of thinking that this kind of contract would discourage someone who was seriously suicidal, but there is another huge problem here:
Hypothetically, suppose the contract would actually get a suicidal person to seek mental health assistance, because contracts work so well at restraining all sorts of other mental health problems. Except, the kid doesn’t even know what suicide means so how would she know that she’s contemplating the thing the contract says requires her to seek assistance?
Re: It's even dumber than that
Add to that they’re teaching five year olds that they can be bound by contracts, more than a decade before they should be. What could paedos do with that, I wonder. “Here, kid, sign this waiver and I’ll give you a cookie. Now, I’m going to teach you how to play Hospital.”
Re: Re: It's even dumber than that
I’ll pile on this one. They are also teaching a 5 year old that it is OK TO SIGN A CONTRACT YOU DO NOT UNDERSTAND. Shouldn’t they be encouraging someone to read what they sign, fully understand it, and if they don’t ask questions FIRST?
Re: Re: It's even dumber than that
Don’t forget the part where you end up homeless because you couldn’t afford the bill.
Good for her!
That way she is educated that sanity, decency, common sense, free will or religion count less than a signed contract.
She will grow into a good citizen and servant of her corporate masters.
I am sure that the medieval devils are envious: they needed to have contracts signed in blood in order to gain power over life, death and afterlife.
Today’s kids are to feel bound just the same by signing their life and death away with ink.
My concern here is what gives them the right to speak to this child about suicide,, or any form of rhetoric without the parents being present and consenting to it.
They should have first asked themselves this question: Are we just stupid or could this happen?
Someone please go on Google and see if there is a single documented case of a five year old committing suicide. If No, then it is a safe bet that one of us in this meeting is just a moron. If yes, then lets do the stupid thing.
It doesn’t matter anyway, because this little girl had forgotten this incident by the time first recess was over. Time to draw one of those big guns daddy like so much. Yea, 2nd Amendment. Oh, what’s an amendment? I’m just five.
As a mother, I would be seriously pissed off if I had to explain to my 5 year old what suicide is because some moron adult decided to breech the topic with them. I hope she sues the hell out of that school district. NO 5 YEAR OLD SHOULD EVEN KNOW WHAT SUICIDE IS!
At what point...
At what point do we say enough is enough and fire these morons running the school and get people in there who actually have brains and the ability to use them?
A) Does a 5 year old have any concept of killing someone, let alone themselves? Has there EVER been a reported incident of a 5 year old deliberately committing suicide?
B) A five year old is not 18, so anything they sign is a worthless piece of paper.
C) What type of moron puts the type of idiots who don’t understand A&B in charge of teaching monkeys, let alone children.
Re: What type of moron puts the type of idiots who don't understand A&B in charge of teaching monkeys, let alone children.
School boards.
Re: Re: What type of moron puts the type of idiots who don't understand A&B in charge of teaching monkeys, let alone children.
…School boards…
In my area school boards are elected.
Like other elections we (usually) have to choose between the lesser of evils.
Unlike other elections school board members are NOT paid for their time in office.
Re: Re: What type of moron puts the type of idiots who don't understand A&B in charge of teaching monkeys, let alone children.
Yup – everyone on the board of education in this district should be immediately dismissed along with anyone that even knew this was happening and did not try to stop it.
The arguments for home schooling increase by the day. This is the long game being played by the advocates of gun control.
Re: Re:
The solution to keeping guns and gun-violence out of schools is simple: ban pop-tarts, because that’s where it all starts.
Re: Re: Re:
That is completely ridiculous.
We should be forcing Kellogg Company to do something to make the use of Pop Tarts safer and create laws that make them pay if something does go wrong in a school.
So, let me get this straight. This school, who went overboard over a child doing something totally harmless, who didn’t even know what suicide was, something that should have been left to the parents to decide, has introduced this child to suicide?
How does that work? A school gets a child to sign a no-suicide pact, when that child didn’t even know what suicide was, violating the rights of the parents?
That’s like a school deciding that it wants to end gun violence in schools, decides to get its students to sign a ‘no gun’ contract when the students don;t know what guns or gun violence is?
LOLS
Talk about a school administration’s ridiculousness. In any event, if a student intends to commit suicide, a signed contract isn’t going to exactly deter that student.
Wow…. I don’t know what to say … Fire everyone in that school district as I am sure the district came up with these forms. Just WOW, what F*****G Morons.
Any wonder the usa schools are the worst in the world?
I’m surprised the drooling psychopaths didn’t call the cops and have her tazed to death.
I'm glad
I am so glad the school system is there and has prevented her from becoming a killer. Maybe they should have all the kids in the school sign in and put it up on their billboard that they are 100% free from child killers.
But then we would have to take this to a national level and have all the kids sign this so the schools could get their federal money.
Re: I'm glad
I’m surprised they didn’t have counselors on hand for any child that was “traumatized.”
Who are these numbskull parents?
Honestly, who lets their kid sign something so stupid? Yeah, maybe they can’t get a lawyer, but for christ’s sake everybody’s got a friend or family member they trust to talke to in life’s more insane moments.
School Nazi: she must zign zee paperz
Idiot Parent: ok
or
School Nazi: she must zign zee paperz
Idiot Parent: excuse me while I make a call
“dad, the school principal wants my kid to sign a contract”
Dad: “wtf are you doing? man up and tell them to pound sand”
Re: Who are these numbskull parents?
The mother didn’t know about he “contract” until after they had the child sign it.
Re: Re: Who are these numbskull parents?
She should have read the kid Miranda when she was born.
nice
wikipedia page for the school district….
“The Mobile County Public School System (MCPSS) is a fascist police state that routinely violates civil rights by arresting 5-year-old children for “drawing guns” and making them sign insane “anti-suicide pacts.””
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_County_Public_School_System
Re: nice
Hahaha, this is actually there. I wonder how long before it gets fixed?
Re: Re: nice
Fixed? Seems accurate to me.
Other noxious ideas
Hell, if they can do this (and get away with it because the parents are too fucking stupid to not do it), they’ll try GPS monitoring the kid for the rest of her schooling.
“You’re a threat to yourself and others..so you have to wear this bracelet to help us keep better track of you.”
Jesus..what have we come to as a country? Schools have too much power to inflict havoc and insanity over their charges..and they love it. They revel in their power.
Because they’re the ones who recommend if a child gets drugs for controlling their behavior, suspend children for even daring to play games or think differently.
Time to fire administrators, all of them.
LaPierre
Someone should ask Wayne LaPierre if he has any issue with this.
Then they should ask him if he has a problem with being a proponent of the gun culture which created this situation.
A contract huh
I thought contracts had to be signed by someone over the age of 16, or 18, or something like that. Isn’t signing that contract a waste of time?
If they were to use this contract against the girl, parents, or even to protect themselves, wouldn’t a judge just throw it out on the basis it was signed by a 5 year old?
Re: A contract huh
This has been discussed a lot above, but the bigger problem is what do you do to someone that has violated a no-suicide contract? Put their corpse in jail?
Public schools
The government schools are not agents for the public good in their history, principles, or fact.
“The most erroneous assumption is to the effect that the aim of public education is to fill the young of the species with knowledge and awaken their intelligence, and so make them fit to discharge the duties of citizenship in an enlightened and independent manner. Nothing could be further from the truth. The aim of public education is not to spread enlightenment at all; it is simply to reduce as many individuals as possible to the same safe level, to breed and train a standardized citizenry, to put down dissent and originality. That is its aim in the United States, whatever the pretensions of politicians, pedagogues and other such mountebanks, and that is its aim everywhere else.” — H. L. Mencken
Alabama home of many ignorant bible thumpers.
Child Abuse
A parent who would let their child attend this school is guilty of child abuse.
This makes me terrified to send my daughter to school. Home schooling keeps looking better and better…
Re: Re:
There is a way to send you child to public school (which, generally, I think is a much better idea than homeschooling) while still protecting your child: join the PTA or, even better, get a spot on the school board. Getting on the school board is usually pretty easy to do.
There are a bunch of really good things you’d get from this, but the two that are most relevant here are that you’d be able to influence school policy (even from the PTA — remember, schools are terrified of parents) and that you’d have advance warning of any really objectionable policies the school has or is putting into place, so you know when the time is right to pull your child out.
Re: Re: Re:
…or, even better, get a spot on the school board. Getting on the school board is usually pretty easy to do.
Very interesting comment.
Maybe this touches the real heart of the problem: Should it be easy?
Or should school board members be thoroughly vetted in order to weed out potential idiots who would likely support zero tolerance policies in an effort to avoid both critical thinking and personal responsibility?
Re: Re: Re: Re:
“Should it be easy?”
No, it should not. But the reason for the ease of it is that there are so few candidates. Most school board seats are elected positions, and most candidates run unopposed.
Re: Re: Re:2 Re:
There is the same problem as with most politics, the average candidate is not someone most people wish to spend any time with, and definitely not someone you ever let see your back. This puts most people off of standing for office.
I wonder if they told him Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny weren’t real while they had his attention.
oh my ...
Mommy, where are we going? And, why are we in this hand-basket?
so who’s to blame for allowing things to get like this?
While they were at it
They should have had her sign pacts not to used illegal drugs (listed by name) or indulge in deviant sexual acts (illustrated for clarity). Can’t be too safe.
The usual planning for a 0.000001% chance
If doesn’t matter if there’s a 0.000001% chance if something happening- too many people, especially school administrators, think they need to be ready for it. Will a terrorist ever hijack a school bus? No, but let’s spend time and resources scaring, I mean drilling, elementary school students just in case.
Will a 5 year-old kill herself? No, but the school has to have liability protection just in case. Though like everyone else is saying, 5 year-olds can’t legally sign contracts since they don’t even have the mental capacity to understand what a contract means.
I agree that it’s past time people stood up to insane policies and administrators.
The state believes they own your children. Parents just create their children, they do not have any rights to them according to most power hungry politico’s
Death of Common Sense
A couple weeks ago, someone at the public school where my wife teaches left a bagel in the toaster too long and set off the fire alarms. Most of the teachers in the area new that it was only burnt toast, but everyone in the school building was, of course, evacuated. Two wasted hours passed while fire fighters were called in to do a full inspection of the premises, during which time everyone in the school had to wait outside. If we burn toast in our homes, I think we all have the common sense to remove the toast, turn off the fire alarm, and continue on. But it is assumed that the same teachers and administrators that we have entrusted with the enormous task of educating our children don’t have the common sense to make even the simplest of judgment calls any more. Who put these nameless, faceless idiots in charge that are supposedly running the show in our public schools?
Re: Death of Common Sense
They can’t even put in protocols for limited evacuation like hospitals use, where you can close off the relevant wing, or evacuate sideways. Or have fire alarms capable of telling smoke or heat presence or whether it’s spreading.
No, full-on over-reaction.
Well its not like people have not been killed for less in the US. Even just holding a gun-like object can get you murdered by the cops so it kinda makes sense to evaluate her suicidal thoughts.
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5 year old
I recommend we stop calling them public schools and call them what they really are… Government schools.
The way to stop this crap is to sue the teachers involved personally as child abusers for damaging the young girl with concept of suicide and other dark thoughts. Better yet get police to arrest them for child abuse.
Public School - Long Time Bastion of the Left
The Public Schools in the US have long been pawns and play things of the radical Left in the US, from the days of forced busing (which created a worse segregation of today’s schools than during the civil rights era in the name of integration), to Michelle Obama’s lunch revolution against obesity (which brought out high school protesters, schools dropping the federal lunch aid program, and the ridicule of celebrity chefs), to whole language instruction (that lowered a whole generation’s reading and comprehension abilities), to bi-lingual education (which kept a whole generation of immigrants from learning English), to new math (which plunged US international test scores to the lowest ever), to union sweetheart contracts (which made firing incompetent teachers nearly impossible), to ever lower teacher education requirements diluted by social engineering courses (which made teachers less knowledgeable in their teaching fields than liberal arts majors), to teacher union wars on every research proven educational reform (e.g. ability groupings), to playground areas stripped of all play equipment (to keep kids safe – and paradoxically bored and obese, especially boys), to increased funding for education routed to support staff increases (i.e. more assistant assistant principals, EO officers, and teachers paid to do union work instead of teach), etc.
US schools have become more and more indoctrination camps of Leftist hate: hate of white males, hate of Western democracy, hate of Western civilization, hate of heterosexuality, hate of parental rights (school officials can’t give minor girls an aspirin without parental consent, but can take them secretly for abortions), hate of Christianity, etc.
It’s hard to find a more dedicated institution, funded by tax dollars, dedicated to undermining Western democratic institutions and traditions. The Public Schools are bastions of Leftist policy and have been for decades. Anyone who thinks otherwise has a head buried deeply in the sand. Thank God for the counter-conformity movement of private schools and home schooling.
Re: Public School - Long Time Bastion of the Left
Ladies and gentlemen, there you have it: this, for your amusement, is what an inferior, uneducated mind that’s pumped full of batshit crazy conspiracy theories sounds like. You can almost see the racism, bigotry and intolerance dripping from its mouth — always hung wide, drooling, in a fixed stupid grin. Sssssh! Don’t frighten it: it’s weak and cowardly and easily scared into reaching for the stash of guns it uses as a substitute for intelligence and courage. No…just stand quietly and admire how anyone manages to live inside an intellect so clearly impoverished and wholly inadequate.
Re: Public School - Long Time Bastion of the Left
An excellent summation, CW. Ideological revolutionaries of all kinds are naturally going to be drawn to the public school system, and it’s there that they establish their primary beachhead in a never-ending war against tradition and culture .
But ironically, those who fight for cultural revolution will some day find themselves defending against it’s onslaught when the revolutionaries turn and start attacking them for their own way of thinking. Isn’t it odd how the people who fought for –and benefited from– the civil rights for racial minorities campaigns in the 1960s are among the most stubborn resisters of civil rights for sexual/gender minorities today.
Re: Public School - Long Time Bastion of the Left
The only levels of hate I ever see at this level is spouted by the Right, especially the Religious Right, railing against the slow improvement of society and civil rights, this generation the same as every preceding one.
I could transpose this entire rant back 150 years to a Confederate newspaper with minimal changes and it would be exactly the same attitude.
As a European centrist (so waaaaay left by US Fascist standards) the left doesnt’ hate “white males, Western democracy, Western civilisation, heterosexuals, parental rights, or Christianity”.
We hate racist attitudes and undeserved feelings of superiority, we hate abuse of democracy and the constant rise of totalitarianism (on both sides), we hate the abuses of Western civilisation as much as we hate the abuses of Eastern, African and Middle Eastern civilisation (but we live in the West…); we hate heterosexuals thinking they are the only correct/non-sinful option [and I’m straight]; we hate abuse of any rights, be they governmental, corporate, religious or parental; and we hate religions who not only do not practice what they preach, but cannot preach accurately what their religion advocates – and also want to ram it down everyone else’s throats.
We are against hypocrisy and discrimination and hatred and war-mongering and the corporate takeover of society and disenfranchisement and the removal of social protections and the destruction of public health.
This doesn’t excuse stupidty in all directions, with political correctness getting tangled up in an over-litigious society, but seriously, you Americans really really really really love to live in fear – of terrorists, blacks, the gub-mint, or of not having your penis substitutes. Grow the hell up.
And I bet the teachers were very smug and concerned!
OK, yeah yeah we all know its insane by any measure of common sense what they did. But, picture this, I bet the teachers and staff were as smug and condescending, they of course can’t talk about it, because its about the children. That give them blanket immunity from any objective semblance of responsibility. They can hide behind that protection, that same protection that whistle blowers used to have, but has been stripped away. Years ago we would of laughed at the “nut job” teacher who was so lacking in common sense they would do things like this and the principal would apologize and be embarrassed, but today this type of narcissistic moral posture is becoming the norm. OMG look little Sally pulled a Twinkie out of her lunch box, its very phallic, call the authorities!!! OMG the children, we have to protect them.
Now just a goldang minute, there!
This school, instead of being excoriated for such abysmally bad judgment and incredible stupidity, should be lauded. After all, the FIVE YEAR OLD was able to sign her name. Such literacy skills in a five year old are difficult to inculcate. A ceremony should be held honoring her teacher – outside in the parking lot and it should involve a lot of ripe old rotten tomatoes.
“A public elementary school in the United States, an agent for the public good,”
Where did you get that idea?
It's A Red Neck State People!
Alabama doesn’t have too many smart people unless they are working at Lockheed Martin! I am surprised to read these comments and if the child isn’t told the definition she will damn sure look it up online. I was living with my GF in Phoenix when her son looked up the word F*CK because to me it was an expression of OMG or what went wrong! We laughed upon seeing this and the kids grew up just fine! Sooner or later she will forget this incident unless reminded of it day after F*CKEN DAY SO LET IT ALONE AND IT WILL GO AWAY! I’M CERTAIN THERE ARE NO CRAYON BULLETS TO LOAD INTO THAT DRAWING EITHER! MAYBE WHO SHE AIMED THE PICTURE OF A PIG SMELLED AND THIS IS WHY SHE SAID PEW PEW!
COWARD or Anonymous Coward
Why would anyone of you go down to the cowards level? It refuses to put a name to the post! Anyone who does not stand up in America and POST their real name has NOTHING of IMPORTANCE TO SAY OR ARGUE ABOUT! This child isn’t so ignorant to ask what the word “SUICIDE MEANS!” ANY COWARD IN AMERICA IS NOT AN AMERICAN TO ME! SHUT UP, GO AWAY AND EITHER PUT UP YOUR NAME AND STAND ON YOUR SOAP BOX YA JERK! THERE ARE CERTAIN STATES WHERE THE ADULTS ARE MORE IGNORANT THAN THE CHILDREN AND IF THIS CHILD CAN EVEN PRONOUNCE SUICIDE SHE IS SMARTER THAN THE CONTRACT THAT CAN FOLLOW HER FOR THE REST OF HER LIFE! MY DAUGHTER WAS UNDERAGE AND STUPID ENOUGH TO STEAL WITH A FRIEND AND GOT CAUGHT! WHEN SHE JOINED THE NAVY THEY KNEW ABOUT THAT INCIDENT AND SHE WAS 11 YEARS YOUNG LIVING WITH HER CRACK WHO*E MOM! I GOT CUSTODY AND WHEN SHE WAS BULLIED IN A MAGNET SCHOOL IN HALLENDALE, FL. I DROVE HER TO SCHOOL AND TOLD THEM TO SETTLE THIS BIT*H DOWN OR I WILL! BY 3PM IT WAS OVER AND THE BULLY WAS GONE FROM THE SCHOOL! ONLY THE BEST OF THE BEST GET INTO THESE SCHOOLS AND SHE SPENT 5 BY 12 HOURS PER DAY TO SUCCEED TO GET HER DIPLOMA! THE BULLY HAD TO GO BACK TO THE SCHOOL AFTER BEING EXPELLED FOR 6 WEEKS! THEN SHE HAD TO REGISTER ALL OVER AGAIN AND THE LAST I HEARD WAS SHE HAD TO REPEAT HER JUNIOR YEAR SO THE TOUGH GIRL GOT FUC*KED WITHOUT BEING KISSED! This contract will never leave this girls file unless her parents ask for it back or take it to court to be thrown out because she is underage to sign any binding contract! This is more serious than many of you think because the government back in 1994 had my daughters report of shoplifting but the store refused to press charges & she was 11. BIG BROTHER HAS BEEN HERE BEFORE 1984! THE SCUM BAG MONICA BLOWING CLINTON IS NOT SEX IN HIS MIND AND THIS IS THE IDIOT WHO HAD THIS COUNTRY IN THE BLACK! WE ARE RIGHT NOW GOING ON 18 TRILLION BUCKS AND I DIDN’T WANT TO LIST IT IN NUMBERS BECAUSE MOST OF YOU CLOWNS COULDN’T FIGURE OUT WHERE THE COMMAS BEGIN FOR A TRILLION BUCKS!
Re: COWARD or Anonymous Coward
Thanks for giving me today’s belly laugh.
I do not support the lofty and ambitious goal of having teachers teach children “how to think” because I do not believe that low-ranking civil servants, as a group, are particularly good at it themselves.
Hopefully situations like this will be used in the future as examples of completely absurd worst-case scenarios.
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